Re: 為啥洋基出Cano比Wang的薪水少

看板CMWang (王建民 - 大樹哥)作者TheFaith (信念RELOAD)時間18年前 (2008/01/22 17:01)推噓13(13推 0噓 9→)

留言22則, 13人參與討論串9/16 (看更多)

※ 引述《Sizemore24 (the diving catch)》之銘言： : → :他好一點的薪水嗎? 畢竟Cano在洋基的重要性比王低太多 01/20 18:31 : 我一直不懂講 Cano 在洋基的重要性比 Wang 低太多的根據在哪裡？雖然這是 Wang 的個 : 人版，有時候政治立場選擇正確很重要 ... : 目前坊間較常被拿來評估貢獻度的 Win Shares 或 VORP 這兩個貢獻數據，一是 Cano 贏 : 而另一是 Wang 贏 (而且 VORP 並不看 Cano 的防守貢獻)，這就不提了，有沒有另外更具 : 公信力的數據指標或是說法，來告訴我這兩個人誰是重要性較高的？或者判斷 Cano 在 : Yankees 的重要性比 Wang 低太多這句話是否合理？ : Wang 的確是在 Yankees 去年投手屢出狀況時為輪值圈頂起缺口，但相對的 Cano 去年也 : 交出幾乎是全美聯 Top 3 的二壘手攻守综合成績，兩人的角色換成任何一個相對只有「 : 聯盟平均」的球員，都可能讓去年 Yankees 能否進 playoff 驚險度更高 (對照追在後面 : Tigers 與 Mariners 都只 Yankees 差了 6 勝。) : 再把農場或球隊之中其他可能的替代人選考慮進去，我更不明白「重要性低太多」這句話 : 了。你發現了WinShare跟VORP各有勝負時，你有沒有去查查看為什麼WinShare跟VORP會給出不太相同的答案，首先，我們先來看WS It considers statistics for players, in the context of their team, and assigns a single number to each player for his contributions for the year. All pitching, hitting and defensive contributions by the player are taken into account. Statistics are adjusted for park, league and era. A win share represents one-third of a team win, by definition. If a team wins 80 games in a season, then its players will share 240 win shares. Players cannot be awarded negative win shares, by definition. Some critics of the system argue that negative win shares are necessary. In defense of the system, proponents argue that very few players in a season would amass a negative total, if it were possible. However, critics argue, when one player does amass a negative total, he is zeroed out, thus diminishing other players' Win Shares totals. In an attempt to fix this error, some have developed a modified system in which negative Win Shares are indeed possible. 用一句話來簡單形容，WS就是該球員在球隊所有勝場中，貢獻了幾勝。但是有一點要注意那就是球員並不會有負的WS，也就是你就算用了一袋球當2B，他的WS也是正的，這裡就有一點端倪了。接下來看VORP In baseball, value over replacement player (or VORP) is a statistic invented by Keith Woolner that demonstrates how much a hitter contributes offensively or how much a pitcher contributes to his team in comparison to a fictitious "replacement player," who is an average fielder at his position and a below average hitter.[1] [2] A replacement player performs at "replacement level," which is the level of performance an average team can expect when trying to replace a player at minimal cost, also known as "freely available talent." 也用一句話形容，VORP就是指該球員跟所謂"Replacemanet level"比起來有多厲害。這時，如果你用一袋球當2B，他的VORP就是負的了。綜合以上這兩點，可以得出一個沒有經過什麼科學驗證的結論，那就是Cano或許比Wang 更靠近該守備位置的Replacement level，而球員薪資的決定，往往來自於他跟該守備位置的其他球員所比較的結果，那即是說，Wang比Cano更貴的決定性原因在於，會贏球的先發投手是稀有財，而會打擊的二壘手雖然也很少見，但是較易於找到取代品。而事實上，若是洋基跟王若是走向薪資仲裁庭，跟洋基隊有幾個堪用先發是沒有關係的因為仲裁庭並不會考慮洋基有幾個能用的先發投手，而是考慮說與王成績相仿的投手領多少錢等等因素，來決定誰獲勝。 -- ※ 發信站: 批踢踢實業坊(ptt.cc) ◆ From: 192.192.90.211

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